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Post by exhaustedandtired/1208 Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:42 pm


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Post by exhaustedandtired/1208 Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:45 pm

Also his big put us back to work plan is once again roads, rail, bridges and high speed internet infrastructure, so if you are a construction worker then you MAY stand a short term chance! .. On Sept. 5th.. you will hear the same old agenda.. BIG speeches about nothing once again and more stimulus money to pay for it again. AND I am betting 99er's will not be in any scope. Time will tell. IMHO!

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Post by exhaustedandtired/1208 Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:48 pm

How can an Illegal have RIGHTS If they're Illegal!

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Post by exhaustedandtired/1208 Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:53 pm

American unemployed, where are your rights???? For benefits, job training, job placement, discrimination for unemployed that have been out of the workforce for a long time and denied jobs. extented benefits for survival???

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Post by Guest Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:29 pm

1208,#1 I suggest, since this upsets you so much, you not watch on Sept. 5th.

#2. For over 75 years, this country has welcomed people, gave them the greenlight to come to this country to avoid all types of persecution, the fact the our government screwed up the process is not the fault of many immigrants, my grandparents and great grandparents being some of them. They never tracked them, gave them no need to register or become citizens. Now some 50 years later when it's problematic, our government wants to ship everyone elsewhere. Maybe, just maybe, these people would all be citizens now if they weren't given impossible standards and paperwork to provide to become citizens. If they did the proper paperwork when people came here, granted asylum properlyl,we wouldn't have this problem, but it's huge now and it would require hiring thousands of processors to correctly document and grant citizenship after checking backgrounds. This problem has been growing and growing and been ignored by all past Presidents, now it's an issue.

As for illegals taking our jobs, well as an NJ resident, the crummy, unhealthy, unsafe poor paying jobs that they get here are not something anyone who was previously employed would or will do, don't even try that argument. The pickers as we call them here and out in Kennett Square PA live in former chicken coops with multiple families and work back breaking manual labor jobs for about 5 months a year for $4 plus "housing". 1208, don't try the argument you'd take it, you wouldn't.

#3, our infrastructure is crumbling, we need people to do roads, bridges, fix power grids, levies etc. Those tasks will also require companies to hire administrative people, to order supplies, pay people, billing, copying, getting permits etc. It will employ electricians, plumbers, architects, all types of engineers etc. It is limited, I agree, but the federal government cannot force private companies to hire. And, if the Republicans had been less concerned about the banks, the initial stimulus and American Recovery Act could have been larger, like the President asked and was refused. So, 1208, get the facts straight.

As far as our rights. We have the capability and the freedom to choose where and what type of work we do, the government does not have the ability to make people hire us. So our rights come from labor laws that mention nothing about companies must hire, just what they must do once they hire.

We need help, I know as well if not better than you. We have a right to expect help, doesn't mean we will get it. With this class of Republicans, especially those who think FEMA funding now needs to be offset to fund the damage from the hurricane, I will keep taking my chances with our President. Rick Perry, Mitt Romney and Michelle "empty suit" Bachman care more about their bottom lines and the NRA than any American, starving or otherwise. Paul Ryan, Eric Cantor, John Boehner, Mitch McConnell, Ron Paul, Rand Paul, yeah, good luck with that crowd. They'd cut off their own Mother's social security.


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Post by exhaustedandtired/1208 Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:50 pm

Its results from promises Mary Kay and no you are not the authority with so called facts and don't tell me about 75 yrs welcoming people , that part you are right, my parents were decendants of immigrants but the LEGAL way! As I gave an illustration recently about some having their hand in a bucket of red hot coals and and the other hand in a bucket filled with Ice and they couldn't tell the difference while the Hot bucket was destroying their hand being ignored! You have your views and I have mine! Its about survival for millions and not at the hands of immigration laws being ignored. Otherwise why have laws! Maybe prisoners should protest to be freed for their rights! Laws are laws and apply to everyone! I am not arguing against infrastructure but against a plan targeting that sector expecting it to produce jobs for [everyone]. It will be a self serving bragging rights so when many construction workers already working in that field and maybe hire a few more then Obama can brag about all the new jobs he created. But what about the whole economy and putting millions back to work in other sectors of the economy! (from an improving economy)
The part about our govmt. not having the ability to make people hire. What a contradiction to you views. Obama is throwing money at the roads, rail, bridges etc!! And thats where the jobs will be.. In infrastructure..looks like to me thats jobs the gov. has control over. The gov. can throw money after any sector and get people hired if it wants to, after all, look at the auto industry and BTW! What about the banks we threw billions. to save jobs. I really don't think you know better than I But you surely have your opinion and I have mine! I guess while I am only giving you my frustrated opinions filled with criticism but still respect you for yours but I guess bottom line is the results the future holds then we will be able to see who may be right and who may be wrong! No matter, your views or mine, I hope one of us is right and things get better. Thats the bottomline!

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Post by exhaustedandtired/1208 Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:52 pm

MaryKay wrote:1208,#1 I suggest, since this upsets you so much, you not watch on Sept. 5th.

#2. For over 75 years, this country has welcomed people, gave them the greenlight to come to this country to avoid all types of persecution, the fact the our government screwed up the process is not the fault of many immigrants, my grandparents and great grandparents being some of them. They never tracked them, gave them no need to register or become citizens. Now some 50 years later when it's problematic, our government wants to ship everyone elsewhere. Maybe, just maybe, these people would all be citizens now if they weren't given impossible standards and paperwork to provide to become citizens. If they did the proper paperwork when people came here, granted asylum properlyl,we wouldn't have this problem, but it's huge now and it would require hiring thousands of processors to correctly document and grant citizenship after checking backgrounds. This problem has been growing and growing and been ignored by all past Presidents, now it's an issue.

As for illegals taking our jobs, well as an NJ resident, the crummy, unhealthy, unsafe poor paying jobs that they get here are not something anyone who was previously employed would or will do, don't even try that argument. The pickers as we call them here and out in Kennett Square PA live in former chicken coops with multiple families and work back breaking manual labor jobs for about 5 months a year for $4 plus "housing". 1208, don't try the argument you'd take it, you wouldn't.

#3, our infrastructure is crumbling, we need people to do roads, bridges, fix power grids, levies etc. Those tasks will also require companies to hire administrative people, to order supplies, pay people, billing, copying, getting permits etc. It will employ electricians, plumbers, architects, all types of engineers etc. It is limited, I agree, but the federal government cannot force private companies to hire. And, if the Republicans had been less concerned about the banks, the initial stimulus and American Recovery Act could have been larger, like the President asked and was refused. So, 1208, get the facts straight.

As far as our rights. We have the capability and the freedom to choose where and what type of work we do, the government does not have the ability to make people hire us. So our rights come from labor laws that mention nothing about companies must hire, just what they must do once they hire.

We need help, I know as well if not better than you. We have a right to expect help, doesn't mean we will get it. With this class of Republicans, especially those who think FEMA funding now needs to be offset to fund the damage from the hurricane, I will keep taking my chances with our President. Rick Perry, Mitt Romney and Michelle "empty suit" Bachman care more about their bottom lines and the NRA than any American, starving or otherwise. Paul Ryan, Eric Cantor, John Boehner, Mitch McConnell, Ron Paul, Rand Paul, yeah, good luck with that crowd. They'd cut off their own Mother's social security.



While you mention them cutting off SS for their mothers, remember Obama is also for cutting SS and medicare and more, he has said so. Remember the buckets, hello! Don't ignore Obama while you drop all the terrible repubs. names.

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Post by truth Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:46 am

[quote="exhaustedandtired/1208]



While you mention them cutting off SS for their mothers, remember Obama is also for cutting SS and medicare and more, he has said so. Remember the buckets, hello! Don't ignore Obama while you drop all the terrible repubs. names.[/quote]

1208,

We remember your claim about the President saying he is for cutting SS.We also remember that, in spite of clear and repeated requests for a reference to a direct quote to that effect on his part, you have been utterly unable to provide one. Why can't you provide the quote? Were you the only person on earth who "heard him say so"? Didn't a single media source publish it? If you can't come up with a reference, there is absolutely no reason we should accept the accuracy of your claim. As far as I'm concerned, this failure on your part calls into question the factual foundations of any and all your other factual claims.

Yes. We are all welcome to have our own opinions*, but your claim regarding what the President has allegedely said regarding SS was presented by you as a fact*, one that you have not been able to support in spite of a couple of patently failed attempts that contained no such quote.

So, where is the quote, 1208? I'm still waiting. I won't even go into some of the other supposed "facts" you posted without support in the other thread.

*I assume that you know the difference between opinion and fact. You may be, for whatever reason or non-reason of the opinion that Pres. Obama wants to cut Social Security. That's fine. That's your opinion. It is quite another thing to submit as fact an assertion that Pres. Obama said he wants to cut Social Secutity. The later can be tested for veracity. That's what I have been doing. Thus far, your statement fails the test.

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Post by truth Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:02 am

Yes. We remember the buckets. That sort of thing is called an ad hominem argument, a loser in any debate.

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Post by Guest Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:56 am

1208, I amm most definitely not an expert on anything. Just don't make immigration an argument and place it on our President's shoulders. This has been ignored by every President for 50 years because our Senators and Congress have no "gumption". It's been an enormous problem for half a decade and has absolutely nothing with our "jobs" situation. It's a safety factor, a tracking factor, a health factor, not to mention the labor law infractions which no one ever wants to tackle, because those employers are usually large contributors to state and federal campaigns.

This President is not solely responsible for that. That is my argument. Don't ever accuse me of trying to be an expert, ever. Understood. I personally have never taken that track, never would. I will not stand for anyone putting words in my mouth or making statements that are not true. I have, many times asked you to tone it down, your statements, while not facts either, are inflammatory and can have an effect on certain members here that isn't good, and in some cases scares them.

Lastly, if you are going to insist on quoting the President on Social Security cuts, please make sure you list the link. Several of us have asked for it, you have not provided it, just your interpretation of it.

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