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A World Without Jobs

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A World Without Jobs

Post by USA Citizen on Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:17 pm

A World Without Work
By ROSS DOUTHAT

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/opinion/sunday/douthat-a-world-without-work.html

IMAGINE, as 19th-century utopians often did, a society rich enough that fewer and fewer people need to work — a society where leisure becomes universally accessible, where part-time jobs replace the regimented workweek, and where living standards keep rising even though more people have left the work force altogether.

Hey. It's OK to be unemployed. Food Stamps are the new normal. Not having a job is just fine if you can live with someone and just have a part-time job. Not having everything you need is just temporary. By 2050 the United States will be richer and everybody will be doing great. Just hum this jingle until then: "I'm on my way to utopia so follow me like a lemming. A world of pleasure and leisure is coming soon. I can forget my goals and just get by with what they say is OK. I'm on my way to utopia. Hey, Hey, Hey."

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by elvis44102 on Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:33 pm

Since the inception of modern "labor saving" devices and the harnesing of machine power we have been told we are doing things more effciently.

productivity is way up and all the (labor cost savings) has been handed over to CEOs because of their brilliant leadership skills , (even when they put thr company out of busines)

as stupid as this may sound all that has to be done is to distribute the remaining work to ALL who want it... (perhaps 3 or 4 day weeks) and then redistribute the money given to CEOS..

NOBOBDY gives things away, if labor unions were still powerfull as they were in the Geat depression they could help for that fight...

the 40 hr work week, 8 hour day are not written in stone..


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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Guest on Sun Feb 24, 2013 8:13 pm

It was the feeling of utopian life, pleasure vs persistence, complacency, and a leisurely life of barbecues, flipping burgers, and living beyond our means years ago that got America into this dilemma in the first place.

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Shakingmyhead on Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:36 pm

I'm not exactly sure where you grew up smindles, but where I did, what you are talking about would have been blasphemy. If someone where I grew up didn't work 7 days a week 15 hours a day they were considered bums. Only the truly ignorant would state that the mess we are in is caused by societies dream for utopia. (you watch way too many movies and waaaaaaay to much MSNBC)

Sure there are people in this country that want something for nothing, there always will be. But when the largest percentage of un or underemployed people in this country are the supervisors/managers/and director level workforce that were making the $50,000+ salaries and were working 80-100 hours a week to make those salaries, the odd weekend off burger flipping and enjoying the fruit of their labor doesn't sound like too much to ask and for sure they don't deserve to be labeled "utopian, living the life of leisure"

The people that grew fat off of taxpayer dollars are the ones whining about losing their programs, the country being in debt and the state of the economy and they look for someone to blame like those "utopian people" who were working hard for something a little bit better and the occasional weekend off. What the blamers don't want to say or at least won’t say it out loud is it's those "utopian people" that paid the taxes from those salaries that funded those free whatever programs and kept this country's debt to a dull roar. Well guess what, those "utopian people" are now jobless due to the reckless actions of our government and their cronies in business they supported so that a CEO could get another $10 million in bonus money and they could get their campaign contributions. The middle class is all but wiped out, who's paying the taxes that support the programs, debt reductions and economic stability? It sure isn't the entry level fry cook at the McDonalds.

So before you lump all American workers into your lil pleasure vs persistence pile, go have a look at what it will cost you to renew your cars registration this year, because without those "utopian people" paying the taxes, you will find that the "fee" is a little more than you are used to.

Put the blame right where it belongs, a corrupt/inept government, and criminal big business culture

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Guest on Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:15 pm

I will not continue point-counterpoint discussions. I've been a hard working American, both in America and abroad all my life.

Unfortunately America got lazy in general many years ago - too many assumptions that their jobs were infallible and needing everything under the sun materialistically. Now our jobs have gone elsewhere as a result.

Americans need to lower their standard of living (not the unemployed) before everything is lost.

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by USA Citizen on Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:36 pm

smindles wrote:I will not continue point-counterpoint discussions.
In honor of your not continuing point-counterpoint discussions, I will also not continue with a point-counterpoint discussion in response to your response about a world without work. Let's just hum this jingle: "I'm on my way to utopia so follow me like a lemming. A world of pleasure and leisure is coming soon. I can forget my goals and just get by with what they say is OK. I'm on my way to utopia. Hey, Hey, Hey."

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Guest on Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:48 pm

USA Citizen wrote:
smindles wrote:I will not continue point-counterpoint discussions.
In honor of your not continuing point-counterpoint discussions, I will also not continue with a point-counterpoint discussion in response to your response about a world without work. Let's just hum this jingle: "I'm on my way to utopia so follow me like a lemming. A world of pleasure and leisure is coming soon. I can forget my goals and just get by with what they say is OK. I'm on my way to utopia. Hey, Hey, Hey."

I think you've misunderstood what I've said. I'm not a part of your jingle. I believe we need to regain America, work hard, and keep our ear to the ground in this new globe economy. That "pleasure and leisure" bullshit was not from me.

I'm currently working at a contract job that just makes ends meet. I'm contributing to this economy and now I need to go back to work before I lose all again.

I'm for the unemployed, not against.

Guest
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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Springflowers on Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:26 pm

elvis44102 wrote:Since the inception of modern "labor saving" devices and the harnesing of machine power we have been told we are doing things more effciently.

productivity is way up and all the (labor cost savings) has been handed over to CEOs because of their brilliant leadership skills , (even when they put thr company out of busines)

as stupid as this may sound all that has to be done is to distribute the remaining work to ALL who want it... (perhaps 3 or 4 day weeks) and then redistribute the money given to CEOS..

NOBOBDY gives things away, if labor unions were still powerfull as they were in the Geat depression they could help for that fight...

the 40 hr work week, 8 hour day are not written in stone..


So why hasn't all the technological development really improved day to day life outside of the SCREEN distractions?

I really would like to know.

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Springflowers on Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:29 pm

[quote="smindles"]
USA Citizen wrote:
smindles wrote:I will not continue point-counterpoint discussions.
In honor of your not continuing point-counterpoint discussions, I will also not continue with a point-counterpoint discussion in response to your response about a world without work. Let's just hum this jingle: "I'm on my way to utopia so follow me like a lemming. A world of pleasure and leisure is coming soon. I can forget my goals and just get by with what they say is OK. I'm on my way to utopia. Hey, Hey, Hey."

People in America can work 80 hours a week, but if there are people living on 10 cents an hour who can undersell you, what good will working hard do? I am serious with this question. The whole world is going downward due to globalism. I hate globalism. It is the biggest mistake this country signed on for. We are all being sunk down to the lowest common denominator. The only way to regain America is to realize that globalism is a lie.

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/global-economy-23-facts-which-prove-that-globalism-is-pushing-the-standard-of-living-of-the-middle-class-down-to-third-world-levels/global-economy-23-facts-which-prove-that-globalism-is-pushing-the-standard-of-living-of-the-middle-class-down-to-third-world-levels

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Springflowers on Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:31 pm

smindles wrote:It was the feeling of utopian life, pleasure vs persistence, complacency, and a leisurely life of barbecues, flipping burgers, and living beyond our means years ago that got America into this dilemma in the first place.

No it is globalism, the greed of global elites, TRILLIONS spent in overseas warsthat did nothing for this country but bankrupt us and enrich a few, TRILLIONS in BANKER-BAIL-OUTS. Sure there were some who were into leisure, but you know some do want to brainwash the SERFS to think of nothing but LOW PAID hours and hours work, and that they deserve what they get while the MONEY TILLS ARE CLEANED OUT.

They are still giving TRILLIONs in hands out to the banks, its just not being publicized as much.

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Guest on Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:10 am

Springflowers wrote:
smindles wrote:It was the feeling of utopian life, pleasure vs persistence, complacency, and a leisurely life of barbecues, flipping burgers, and living beyond our means years ago that got America into this dilemma in the first place.

No it is globalism, the greed of global elites, TRILLIONS spent in overseas warsthat did nothing for this country but bankrupt us and enrich a few, TRILLIONS in BANKER-BAIL-OUTS. Sure there were some who were into leisure, but you know some do want to brainwash the SERFS to think of nothing but LOW PAID hours and hours work, and that they deserve what they get while the MONEY TILLS ARE CLEANED OUT.

They are still giving TRILLIONs in hands out to the banks, its just not being publicized as much.

What I said does not negate what you've additionally said, so why do you reject what I have to offer in saying "No it is...".

You're just running through these threads and contradicting most everyone!

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by elvis44102 on Tue Feb 26, 2013 11:55 am

Springflowers wrote:
elvis44102 wrote:Since the inception of modern "labor saving" devices and the harnesing of machine power we have been told we are doing things more effciently.

productivity is way up and all the (labor cost savings) has been handed over to CEOs because of their brilliant leadership skills , (even when they put thr company out of busines)

as stupid as this may sound all that has to be done is to distribute the remaining work to ALL who want it... (perhaps 3 or 4 day weeks) and then redistribute the money given to CEOS..

NOBOBDY gives things away, if labor unions were still powerfull as they were in the Geat depression they could help for that fight...

the 40 hr work week, 8 hour day are not written in stone..


So why hasn't all the technological development really improved day to day life outside of the SCREEN distractions?

I really would like to know.

Well life expectency has certainly been extended in the last few hundred years, i enjoy washing my clothes at home as apposed to beating them on the rocks down at the river..

i agree with much of what you are saying....
It has been said that one cannot fix a problem with the same thinking that created the problem...

Social Darwinism, The good/bad, us or them Paridigm are the thinking...


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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Springflowers on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:45 am

smindles wrote:
Springflowers wrote:
smindles wrote:It was the feeling of utopian life, pleasure vs persistence, complacency, and a leisurely life of barbecues, flipping burgers, and living beyond our means years ago that got America into this dilemma in the first place.

No it is globalism, the greed of global elites, TRILLIONS spent in overseas warsthat did nothing for this country but bankrupt us and enrich a few, TRILLIONS in BANKER-BAIL-OUTS. Sure there were some who were into leisure, but you know some do want to brainwash the SERFS to think of nothing but LOW PAID hours and hours work, and that they deserve what they get while the MONEY TILLS ARE CLEANED OUT.

They are still giving TRILLIONs in hands out to the banks, its just not being publicized as much.

What I said does not negate what you've additionally said, so why do you reject what I have to offer in saying "No it is...".

You're just running through these threads and contradicting most everyone!

I can tell when someone is set to a board, to stop all discussion. Get what I mean? I don't even believe you are "real". A poor out of work guy usually wouldn't be so defensive of the system. I mean why are you defending the big bankers? That one makes no sense. Hey if you are going to play a role on the internet for astorturfing or whatever you are up to on this board, at least attempt SOME CONSISTENCY. Hey you keep writing that I am wrong about everything and I know the game you are up to. All that spouting off about how Americans are lazy and deserve what they got coming, I mean give me a break. A poor guy doesn't talk like that.


Last edited by Springflowers on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:50 am; edited 2 times in total

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by Springflowers on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:48 am

elvis44102 wrote:
Springflowers wrote:
elvis44102 wrote:Since the inception of modern "labor saving" devices and the harnesing of machine power we have been told we are doing things more effciently.

productivity is way up and all the (labor cost savings) has been handed over to CEOs because of their brilliant leadership skills , (even when they put thr company out of busines)

as stupid as this may sound all that has to be done is to distribute the remaining work to ALL who want it... (perhaps 3 or 4 day weeks) and then redistribute the money given to CEOS..

NOBOBDY gives things away, if labor unions were still powerfull as they were in the Geat depression they could help for that fight...

the 40 hr work week, 8 hour day are not written in stone..


So why hasn't all the technological development really improved day to day life outside of the SCREEN distractions?

I really would like to know.

Well life expectency has certainly been extended in the last few hundred years, i enjoy washing my clothes at home as apposed to beating them on the rocks down at the river..

Life expectancy is going down in America.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/aug/13/usa.ewenmacaskill

As for washing clothes on rocks, just wait til you can't afford the quarters for the washing machines at the laundry mat, nor to repair or buy a washing machine. Ive never been able to afford a washing machine, and can barely afford the quarters for the laundromat. Poverty forced me to wash clothes in a bathtub before which I guess is not much different from rocks in the river.

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Re: A World Without Jobs

Post by DesperateInRI on Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:18 pm

Priorities. It looks like for you, having a pc and internet are more important than quarters for laundry. Why all the doom and gloom?? Advances in medicine and technology have been a huge benefit to ALL of us!

_________________


“Everyone's moving on without me, into a world I don't understand.”

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Re: A World Without Jobs

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